LorienFeanturi/HouseRules

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Special Attacks

I despised the special attacks in the core. They were hardly ever useful and I was tired of trying to pull off something pretty and realizing that it was completely inconsequential.

Disarm

:Dex+combat ability to effectively target/grab the weapon at DC 2. The victim may dodge or parry if she is aware of the attack. If this is successful, the attacker makes a Str+extra successes with a DC of the defender's Combat Ability. It's still difficult to disarm someone if they're aware of an attack, but no longer fucking impossible. Edit: Specialties count towards the first roll. Charms that improve/diminish your ability to disarm (such as Grasping Claw) count towards the second. \\

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Hold

:Normal BrawlLorienFeanturi/HouseRules/MA attack roll at DC 1. May be dodged and parried, Grapple Parry rules apply. If successful, the victim may make a Dex or Str+BrawlLorienFeanturi/HouseRules/MA roll at his initiative to escape the hold. This roll is reflexively opposed by the attacker. The victim can not act except to try to escape the hold. The attacker may attempt a clinch or a throw, but may otherwise take no action. \\

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Clinch

:May only be attempted on a held victim. The attacker rolls Dex+BrawlLorienFeanturi/HouseRules/MA, opposed by the victim's Dex+BrawlLorienFeanturi/HouseRules/MA. Failure means the victim escaped the hold altogether. Ties maintain the hold, but do not engage the clinch. Success puts the victim in a clinch, inflicting Str+2 bashing damage/round for the duration of the clinch. Extra successes do not add to damage. Armor does not increase soak versus a standard clinch: Big Double Ugly doesn't worry about orichalcum articulated plate whilst showing the Princess of Lithe some incredibly unlikely positions in which to find a human body.\\

A character in a clinch may attempt to escape with a Dex or Str+BrawlLorienFeanturi/HouseRules/MA on the initiative of his turn, opposed by the attacker's Dex or Str+BrawlLorienFeanturi/HouseRules/MA. Ties go to the attacker. Alternately, the victim can attempt to reverse the clinch in an opposed Dex or Str+BrawlLorienFeanturi/HouseRules/MA roll, with the attacker getting 1 automatic success. Again, ties go to the attacker. \\ \\

Note: The hold/clinch combination is a throwback to WoD. The Exalted clinch rules were awful, so I proposed this alternative. It's _not_ perfect, no. However, the advantages lie in the fact that 1. You have to have control of the person in order to begin hurting them - joint locks require a dominant position in wrestling and 2. It makes opposing clinches a bit more realistic. Any other proposals better than the exalted system, please contribute.\\ \\

Sweep

:Normal BrawlLorienFeanturi/HouseRules/MA attack roll at DC 2. Does Str-1 bashing damage, extra successes halved (round down) for purposes of increased damage. May be parried or dodged. Grapple Parry rules apply if attempt is made without a weapon. To stay up, the victim makes a reflexive Dex+Athletics roll at DC 1+extra successes on attack roll. \\

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Tackle

:Normal BrawlLorienFeanturi/HouseRules/MA attack roll at DC 2. Does Str+1 bashing damage, extra successes counting as normal. May be dodged and parried, Grapple Parry rules apply. The target makes a Stam+Resistence roll at DC 2+extra successes to stay upright. Success still leaves the target at -2 for the next turn. \\

On success, the attacker needs not make a roll to stay upright, unless he chooses to hold the target and go down with him (automatic hold in effect next turn?) If the tackle is dodged, or misses entirely, the attacker needs to make a Dex+Athletics roll to avoid being off balance and at -2 next turn. \\ \\

Throw

:Normal BrawlLorienFeanturi/HouseRules/MA attack roll at DC 3 (DC 1 if target is already in a hold). Does Str damage if the target falls, extra successes not counting. May be dodged and parried (unless already in a hold). Grapple Parry rules apply. After the throw, the victim rolls Wits+Athletics at DC 2+extra successes to remain upright if possible (getting thrown off of a cliff or building roof makes it kind of irrelevant). Damage is modified at ST's discretion depending on surrounding environment. \\

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Grapple Parries

:Parrying grapples takes some extra modification. If Big Double Ugly tries to tackle the Princess of Lithe, she's going to want to hold up that daiklave of hers and see if Big Double Ugly manages to impale himself on it. For appropriate grapples, the following parry rules are in effect:\\

Normal combat rolls for both the attacker and defender. Should the defender successfully parry, extra successes become soakable damage of the appropriate type as the attacker's force is misdirected by something sharp, pointy or hard.\\ \\

Note: There are two ways to approach this as a player. Assuming the player has held an action for the parry, she can inflict minimal damage while at the same time deflecting a blow. Alternatively, when she sees someone about to tackle her character, she can swing that big ol' daiklave and try to decapitate her attacker, allowing that failing to incapacitate the attacker is going to probably mean getting hit. The ST should consider the appropriate initiative allowances, but in general: if someone has held an action for the purpose of defending, that someone is to be grappled, and he is aware of the grapple - give him the option of swinging away or swatting aside. running over to wrestle with a swordsman is not a safe endeavour.\\ \\

Ranged Grapples

:Certain weapons (ex. fighting chains) allow a character to make ranged grapple attempts. Holds, Clinches and Sweeps can all be done at range. In general, Grapple Parry rules do NOT apply for ranged grapples. Parry all such attacks normally.

• Ranged Sweeps operate exactly as per the normal Sweeps rules.
• Ranged Holds are not escaped with a roll reflexively opposed by the attacker. Rather, the victim spends a number of turns equal to half (round up) the extra successes on the attacker's original roll escaping. The attacker may also act while the victim is held at range.
• Ranged Clinches do not require a Ranged Hold to be placed in effect. However, Ranged Clinch attempts are made at DC 3 and can be parried and dodged normally. Ranged Clinches are likewise escaped unopposed, as per Ranged Holds. Damage from ranged clinches is equal to Str+extra successes bashing damage/turn, ignoring armour for soak. For every turn the victim spends escaping the Ranged Clinch, the damage inflicted per turn decreases by 1. The attacker may also act while the victim is clinched at range.\\

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Note: Ranged Holds and Clinches should also be taken on a case-by-case basis. Obviously, a ranged hold on or by a horseman is going to have some nasty side-effects that need to be factored in with seperate rolls. Even simple actions such as dragging a held victim around on foot is going to force some kind of modification. These suggestions are for very sterilized situations, where the attacker gets a ranged hold/clinch and then stops paying attention.\\ \\ \\

Comments

Ed has brought up the point that bear-hugs are the exception to the armour-ignoring rule in clinches, and stylistically preferred by some very strong characters. He has a point. Should I create a new rule for such Clutches or should i just leave it as is (bear-hugs being the only such exception I can think of)?\\ \\ ~Adam~\\

You should create a username and register and stuff. Then your updates will start looking like you did them, instead of "dhcp-randomness etc", on the RecentChanges page.\\

I'm not sure I see why bear-hugs don't ignore armour, but I do think that someone who uses a bear-hug as their version of a clinch won't be taking damage the same way both people in a clinch usually do.\\ ~ Shataina\\ PS: you people seem to be having fun using real names, but don't use mine around here. call it paranoia. tasty paranoia, like your soul :)

The issue with armour extends beyond just bearhugs, as my shower contemplations convinced me. Having someone in a headlock and wailing away at his kidneys is another Brawl-style tactic. The point of contention is mostly whether or not it merits a seperate system, or whether I should for the sake of simplicity simply use the current Clinch rules. The only systematic difference would be the armour soak, which I might have to compensate for with more damage, no reversals, etc.\\ ~ LorienFeanturi ~

I also agree that you should have your own page, so that I don't have to edit your stuff on my page, mostly. I'm just gonna post random stuff here until you do, in no particular order. For one, so long as there are no specific different types of clinches or holds, then you have to deal with Dex and Str. First off, a character can power out of a clinch, but a character with good dexterity can use some sort of maneuver to maintain the hold. A strong character can also obviously overpower a weaker character. A fast character can slip out of a clinch, but that's more difficult when the character doing the holding is fast, too, or strong. The moral of this story is that I think that most attempts to maintain or break a clinch or hold should be either Str or Dex on the part of the attacker and the defender. - Morpheus

In also think that the DC on the roll to stay up is too high for sweep. A character who is hit by a sweep should have a decent chance of staying up. I'd say just 1 + successes, especially since it does damage, too. That way, if you roll 2 successes, most people will have a very small chance, while elites ln light armor will require a better roll. We might want to consider some sort of semi-universal off-balance rule, too. - Morpheus

The DC 2+ sweep roll was actually a typo by me. It is supposed to be 1+. Duly noted and edited. Any input concerning mobility penalty (remember, no books here. ie - help my stoner memory!)?\\ Point taken on the Str and Dex interchangeability. I didn't include that initially for the sake of simplicity, but I fully agree with you, with one small change. In my experience, engaging in a clinch from a hold is almost entirely a manner of timing, quickness and balance. Thus, the roll to engage the clinch is staying as Dex on my page, unless you can convince me otherwise. All escape rolls will be Dex or Str.\\ ~ LorienFeanturi ~

I agree with you on all points. I think that mobility penalty should apply to the roll to remain standing. - Morpheus

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