Garden/Combat101
Mailanka's Combat 101
Props to Mailanka for this - it's helped us a lot. He hasn't gotten around to adding this to his page yet so I'll leave it here for now. When he does I'll redirect to his area.
Subject: Combat 101\\
Mailanka - 11/07/2002 20:17:58 \\
Some people seem to find Exalted combat confusing, so it is the intention of this thread to shine a little light on the combat system for newbies.
It will begin VERY simplistically, and ramp up from there. It will contain four parts: Basic Combat, Extras, Basic Charm use, and Advanced Charm use.
Feel free to discuss tactics in here as well :)
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Mailanka - 11/07/2002 20:37:27 \\ Fight One: Basic Combat Training
Jaida lifted the practice sword, unsure of herself as she swung it a few times. She pushed back a stray strand of auburn hair, and looked at the master swordsman, feeling very much like the uneducated farmer girl she was.
Alright, here's our heroine! She has the following stats: Strength 2, Dexterity 3, Stamina 3, and a Wits of 3. She is a clever girl, graceful, and has been toughed by life on a farm, though she didn't bail hay like her brothers (hence the Strength of 2). She has a Melee of ZERO. Her practice sword has the following stats: Speed +0, Accuracy +0, Damage -1B, and Defense +0.This means, basically, she does a base damage of 1B, and has a dice pool of 3 to attack and defend.
Steel Ribbon Warrior smiled at her encouragingly. He was tall and slim, an elegant face, and well kept long black hair. He smiled at her encouragingly, delicately bringing his own practice sword before him. --- This is our other character. While totally mortal, Steel is a "musashi" bad ass: Strength 3, Dexterity 5, Stamina 3, Melee 5 (Specialty: Slashing Swords +3), Wits of 4. He is the kind of person who may someday Exalt.
Jaida watched him, unsure, and then, blindly, charged him, flailing out an attack at the confident man. He effortlessly knocked it away, and and she felt his practice sword rap her bottom as she stumbled past.
Her face was flaming with humiliation as she turned to face the serenly smiling man.
Turn 1. (First, a note, for the most part, I will assume that half of the dice (rounded down) in a dice pool come up successes, rather than roll.)
Steel has a iniative total of 9 (Dex 5, Wits 4, Sword +0), while Jaida has 6 (Dex 3, Wits 3, Sword +0). Assuming they role pretty close to one another, Steel gets iniative.
He chooses to hold his action.
She attacks, commiting her entire dice pool to the attack. As she does, Steel splits his dice pool 2 ways (or, takes a multiple action for 2 dice actions), so his first dice pool is (Dex 5, Melee 5, -2 for multiple actions) 8, with 4 successes. She has 3, with 1 success, and he easily parries. His next action is at -3, so he has 7 dice. This is certainly enough to tap her, since she is not defending at all.
Enraged, she lashes out at him, thrashing out two quick blows at Steel Ribbon Warrior. He knocks her clumsy attacks aside, and then lets the tip of his blade slip past her defenses to lightly touch her chest.
Again, Steel gains iniative, and chooses to hold.
She splits 2 ways. Normally, this would be impossible (this would give her a dice pool of 1, 0) but her player stunts it for one point, describing her feelings as she attacks. This makes it 2, 1 (bonuses are applied before negatives).
However, this is hardly enough to get past Steels defenses (split three ways: 7, 6, 5), thus, he parries and gets his hit in.
As soon as he had pulled the sword away from her, he suddenly springs to life, the air whistling through the reeds of the practice weapon as he launches his attack. Terrified, Jaida lifts her sword to defend. Despite the clumsy defense, the two swords clash, and Steel holds his weapon against hers for a moment, then pulls away, smiling. "Good," he says "You have learned that defense is more important than offense. Rest now, girl."
For the last turn of this fight, again, Steel has iniative. He chooses to attack, and splits his dice pool 2 ways, one for an attack, and one for a parry (Steel likes to play it safe...just in case).
Jaida can take no action yet (it isn't her iniative) and so is forced to abort any later action for a parry. Her meager 3 dice won't beat his 8, but Steel is just trying to prove a point, which he does.
End first fight.
Commentary: Many people do not delay their actions, as Steel does. This is generally a good idea, to allow yourself the time to see what your opponent intends. In a mortal on mortal fight, it's generally just better to strike out and force him to abort, but defense is usually a safer option than offense. Subject: Combat 101 Garris - 11/07/2002 20:54:29 - sadness46@hotmail.com Minor side-comment. As Jaida's melee is zero, shouldn't her dice pool for melee+dexterity be 1? Subject: Combat 101 jabberwock - 11/07/2002 20:56:55 Wouldn't our heroine have an attack/parry pool of one? Die pools when the ability is zero are equal to the proper attribute - 2, I think.
(Which would mean that to split two ways, that would have to be SOME stunt! :)
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ jabberwock - 11/07/2002 20:57:48 \\ Damn. I should write less when I'm trying to be a smartass.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Garris - 11/07/2002 21:00:19 - sadness46@hotmail.com \\ Yes, else someone else will be prompt and beat you to it. :P
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Mailanka - 11/07/2002 21:03:55 \\ <<Wouldn't our heroine have an attack/parry pool of one? Die pools when the ability is zero are equal to the proper attribute - 2, I think.>>
Pokes through rules.
Ummm...where is that written?
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Garris - 11/07/2002 21:12:32 - sadness46@hotmail.com \\ Under the abilities section of the traits chapter.
Where the X is, to mark absence of ability on that chart.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Mailanka - 11/07/2002 21:13:45 \\ Well, I'll be damned. You learn something new everyday
- )
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Garris - 11/07/2002 21:21:34 - sadness46@hotmail.com \\ I'm looking forward to the rest of this. It would be nice to have a little Exalted combat-booklet for my rules-illiterate friends.
Thanks a lot for putting in the extra work, Mailanka.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ mstacy - 11/07/2002 21:27:21 \\ I am enjoying this as well...
Just give Jaida a melee of one and move on. The fight outcome will still be the same (it was never in doubt).
Thanks,
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Garris - 11/07/2002 21:29:31 - sadness46@hotmail.com \\ Give her a specialty in straight swords of 2 dice and she'll still have her 3 dice to roll. ^_~
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ mstacy - 11/07/2002 21:33:01 \\ CAN you have a specialty in an ability you don't have?
Thanks,
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Garris - 11/07/2002 21:42:05 - sadness46@hotmail.com \\ Yes, there are no rules to say you can't, and it's certainly possible you will. (You have to start SOMEWHERE, right?)
I was on the losing end of the followup argument with The New Age something or other about whether the -2 penalty should apply regardless. I felt it shouldn't, since they demonstrated aptitude in that aspect of the ability. But popular opinion and Calculus were on his side, that week. And I guess I would never have made a character with a specialty and no ability anyhow.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Mailanka - 11/07/2002 22:06:32 \\ Combat Lesson 2: Extras
Extras are what make the game of Exalted, great, and anyone who has run a BIG fight against extras will quickly note that combat slows down. Hopefully, this illustration will show how to keep your combat fast paced and quick. I also intend to illustrate the tactics of losing initiative.
Steel Ribbon Warrior walked alone on the city road, his thoughts lingering on his student. She was advancing quickly, and this pleased him, but this was not why his mind dwelled on her.
Lost in his thoughts, he almost did not see the flickering motion. There was a silvery flash, and then the sound of metal against metal as Steel Ribbon warrior unsheathed his weapon and parried the thrown knife in one smooth motion.
Assassins!
First, Steel must make a reflexive (free) Wits + Awareness check. We assume he passes enough to parry. Then we get a pretty stunt allowing Steel to parry in the same motion as readying his weapon.
Steel is using a masterwork Slashing Sword, his ancesterol weapon. It gives him a +3 to speed, +2 Accuracy, +3L Damage, +2 Defense. For ease of play, I find it easiest to note my weapon as the writers of Exalted do: All stats and bonuses already added together. So, for Steel, we have a Speed of 12, Accuracy of 15, Damage of 6L(ethal) and a Defense of 15. Incidentally, this is about as cool as mortals get.
Four shadows slipped from the alleyways, knives glinting in the distant lamp light as though they were hungry for his blood. Unprepared for the sudden rush, Steel Ribbon Warrior was forced to give ground to his aggressors, retreating quickly, slipping away from thier slashing blades.
He cries out as a blade kisses his flesh, blood flying into the air. He grits his teeth against the pain, readying his blade for a counter attack.
Turn 1: These are elite Extras, thus, have an init bonus of 6, and a dice pool of 6 in combat. They must have surprised Steel, because they rolled a 10, and he rolled a 1, giving him an init of 13, and them an init of 16.
They go first.
If Steel wants to live, he must abort to a defense. He has a dodge of 3 (thus a dodge pool of 8), meaning that his parry is vastly superior. However, he could only parry once if he aborted, so he is forced to dodge. This is a dice pool of 8, 7, 6, 5. This gives us 4, 3, 3, 2 successes, and our assassins (dice pool of 6) get 3, 3, 3, 3. That last one hits.
Assuming the assasin is of strength 2, with a knife (+1L damage), this is 4 damage (2 from strength, 1 from the knife, and 1 from the success), and it's lethal, so Steel has no soak. This averages 2 health levels. Oww. Steel is hurt (-1 wound penalty)
There are rules for stunning and knock down on page 234 of the main book, but I feel extras wouldn't get that luxury, and it would complicate matters, so I don't bother with them.
Steel launches himself at them, his blade flashing, blood flying. Four quick strokes leave three dead bodies, the other assassin having sprung nimbly away from the blow
Steel rolls better for his iniative this time, and so goes first. He could attack once, and parry the rest, but if he attacks, they'll have to abort to a defense rather than attack, so here, a good offense is the best defense.
He splits his dice pool 4 ways, and with his wound penalty, he's at -1 to hit, giving him a dice pool of (10, 9, 8, 7) (That's 15, -4 for the 4 attacks, -1 for wound, and then and additional -1 for each action there after)
This is an average of 5, 4, 4, and 3 to hit. The Ninja have 6 dodge dice, and thus average 3, 3, 3, and 3. The last dodges.
Now comes the easy part. Because Extras can be automatically wounded for every 3 dice of damage they take, really, all we need to do is make sure we get 9 dice of damage. Steel does 6, so we need 3 successes to incapacitate. If this total is uneven, we can roll the remaining dice, or, if you're feeling generous, just round up the HL's taken.
They ARE just Extras.
With the successes on the hit added it, we get 8, 7, 7 damage. Not enough to instantly kill them, but enough to give each a -3 wound penalty (enough to take them out of the fight) and possibly kill them, with the 8 very likely.
Remember: For Extra's, determine how many successes a PC needs to get his damage up to 9. That's all your checking for, and then roll roll roll. The Extra is either dead, or hurting badly.
The remaining Ninja launches himself at Steel Ribbon Warrior, and contemptously, the swordsman cuts him down.
Once more, Steel has iniative. The Ninja chooses not to abort, because he knows he's going to die, and 14 dice (15 -1 for wound penalty) will do a stellar job of splattering ninja boy.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Garris - 11/07/2002 22:20:49 - sadness46@hotmail.com \\
- Slips in*
It's also important to remember that extras, unlike our heroes, do not get 2 successes for 10s rolled.
In this example the elite extras have been given the benefit of the doubt and their average 2.4 successes has been rounded up to 3, as far as I've seen.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ jabberwock - 11/07/2002 23:12:11 \\ This is a great thread. Kudos to Mailanka.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ ikselam - 11/07/2002 23:41:22 \\ There should be a primer on Advanced Combat, dealing with movement and ranged and mounted combat tactics. Less strict number-crunching there, but they're things that deserve to be touched upon, especially once Charms start coming into play.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ ikselam - 11/07/2002 23:42:37 \\ Haw, this thread should end with a Darth Vader vs. Obi-Wan style duel between Jaida and Steel Ribbon. "When I left you, I was but a learner... now I am the master!"
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Mailanka - 11/07/2002 23:43:48 \\ This is very true. A person with Graceful Crane stance that can lure a foolish Dragon Blooded onto a rooftop to fight is at SUCH an advantage...
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Talons - 11/07/2002 23:46:00 \\ really not bad. keep it rolling bub.
cheers.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Mailanka - 11/08/2002 00:25:31 \\ Combat Lesson 3: Basic Charms
Ok, lets take a moment. We've looked through combat basics. It comes down to this: If you lose init, you parry/dodge. If you have it, you can split for multiple attacks, attacks and defenses, or you can hold to see what your opponent does. If you have questions at this point, feel free to voice them, because we're gonna get complicated.
Let's begin:
There was the sound of metal striking flesh, and the fifth, unseen assassin collapsed to the ground, hand clawing for Steel Ribbon Warrior before finally succumbing to his wound.The swordsman spun to see Jaida standing over the corpse, blood on her face, on her sword. Her first blood. She raised her astonished eyes to him, and he took a step back when he saw what had changed in her.
Jaida watched the fear blossom in his face. She had been attacked herself, and quickly divined that he would need her. If she hadn't been there, he would have died, and she could not bear to see that.
The blood of her first kill mixed with the deepening scarlet of her anima as she stepped forward to Steel Ribbon. "Master, what's wrong?"
The burning mark on her forehead said it all. Her heart broke when she saw his sword rise up against her.
Jaida has improved some since we last saw her, gaining Melee 3. Apparantly, Steel is an excellent teacher. She also wields a straight sword, and has a buff jacket. This gives her the following stats: Speed 6 Accuracy 7 Damage 5L Defense 7. The Buff Jacket adds 3 to her lethal soak of (now) 1 for a total of 4L.
There are no REAL canonical rules for new Exaltation, so we will assume she remains at essence 1, and gains 5 charms "instinctively". We choose Ox-body, Retrieve the Fallen Weapon, Excellent Strike, Golden Essence Block, and Dipping Swallow Defense. This makes her an excellent Melee specialist.
Her personal pool is 8, Peripheral 22.
"Steel...please, what are you doing?"
Her master's face was pale, his hand unsteady as he stepped forward, sword whipping towards her in deadly strokes she knew all too well. Instinctively, drawing on knowledge she had no right to possess, she slide away from the attacks, her blade working furiously to keep the edge away from her skin. Sweat beaded on her forehead.
Steel is still the iniative king in this fight, and gets to go first. He chooses to split his dice pool 4 ways, slashing at her quickly in an effort to slip past her now demonic defenses. This makes his (still wounded) dice pool 10, 9, 8, and 7. More than enough to slide past Jaida's measly 7 defensive dice pool.
Desperate, Jaide chooses to abort to a dodge (assume she has a dodge of 2), and uses Dipping Swallow Defense AS WELL against each attack. This gives her 5+7, 4+7, 3+7 and 2+7 for her defensive dice pools (the first numbers are her dodge pool, the second that which is granted by her charm) She has used up her personal Essence pool.
As Jaida lept from his last attack, her mind worked furiously, coming to grips with what had happened, and she realized she could never bring herself to kill her master. Her mind suddenly seized on a possiblity, and as Steel Ribbon Warrior readied himself for another attack, Jaida launched herself at him.
Before she her blade hit, she dropped to one knee, the glow of her power making her blade brilliant as it slipped past Steel Ribbon's defenses, carressing his thigh at a vulnerable point. He slipped to his knee suddenly, mobility weakened, blood darkening his pants. She backed away as he watched her, waiting for the final blow.
Jaida murmured "I'm sorry." And as tears streamed down her cheeks, she fled her former master.
Jaida is lucky enough to get iniative, and decides she would rather not harm him. Jaida's player asks if it's possible to just "wound him so he can't chase me", and the ST decides that it's ok, since it would further the story.
She uses excellent strike for it's maximum (+6: She has a Dex of 3, and a Melee of 3), and channels compassion for another +3. This gives her a total of 16 dice, against Steels 14. 8 successes versus 7, is enough to slip past the defenses, and achieve victory for Jaida.
It should be noted that this attack isn't canonical, but the point is that a relatively normal warrior was able to wound an extremely capable one, the only differnce being charms.
Also, it shows one of the intricate points of Exalted that will be expanded upon in the next chapter.
A Solar has to choose: A defensive Charm, or an offensive Charm.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ jonmajere - 11/08/2002 05:19:09 \\ This really great Mailanka, keep up the good work.
As a side note you mentioned: "If you lose init, you parry/dodge. If you have it, you can split for multiple attacks, attacks and defenses, or you can hold to see what your opponent does."
If you win the initiative in what circumstances would you a)split for multiple attacks ? b)split for attacks and defense ? c)hold your action ?
I'm sure we'd love to hear your thoughts : )
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Azuth - 11/08/2002 08:35:09 - azuth@chello.no \\ Excellent Post!! Keep up the Good work!
Maybe I might be of a little help in Your Questions mate..
a) When Fighting Multiple Weaker Foes(Extras), since they'll use their action to parry or die in their foolishness, or when Fighting Desperately against a Superior/Equal Foe which You need to get fast or he'll get You.
b) When Fighting a Roughly Equal Foe You know to be capable of both a decent offence as well as defence, since he'll probably be just as afraid of going all out as You are. Going all out and failing to kill Your opponent will leave You very vulnerable.
c) When You're Fighting an Opponent You're very unsure about, since all kinds of things could hit the fan if You Choose an Action without the slightest clue where Your Opponents Strenght lies. And sometimes it's best not to Attack before You actually know You're Facing an Enemy, would be annoying to find Out You just killed a fellow Traveller who drew Weapon just as a Precaution.
Hope this helps a little... it'll help me anyway, since I'm bound to figure out where I'm messing up ;D
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ MyriadOfShades - 11/08/2002 09:27:59 \\ Holding your action is also a good choice against enemy Exalts for the first round or two if you're confident in your defense, since other than simple dice-adders you have no clue what kind of attack each Exalt can bring to bear.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ BUDMAN - 11/08/2002 09:31:16 \\ this is the best thing i have read on the forums in a long time.
budman
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ chris22 - 11/08/2002 11:51:53 - chris22@rocketmail.com \\ I would like to add that holding your action is also sometimes a good idea if you want to use combo. Oftentimes I don't want give an opponent the opportunity to defend against a powerful (but costly attack).
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ ZackSundance - 11/08/2002 12:46:37 - zack_sundance@hotmail.com \\ Mega-ultra-excellent stuff, Mailanka. Just one quick note: In your Mortal Warrior vs. Assassin Thugs example, you forgot to take into account that Steel Ribbon would be bleeding heavily at the end of the fight and would have lost another health level during each of those two rounds after he was wounded. The thugs had probably already bled to death.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Lord_Folken - 11/08/2002 13:52:55 \\ Just a note on the fight with the assasins:
The damage calculation on the hit that attacks is incorrect. The assasin would have had a raw damage of 3, not 4. You need at least 1 success to hit. Extra successes on top of that add to the damage.
Kudos to the efforts. The narrative is very nice and shows what combat in Exalted is supposed to be like.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Lord_Folken - 11/08/2002 13:54:30 \\ um, should be "attack that hits" not "hit that attacks"
Friday afternoon dyslexia.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Sunchaser - 11/08/2002 14:03:55 - suncurrent@aol.com \\ This is terrific stuff Mailanka. I am actually enjoying the little story more than the game mechanics! Please continue!
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ jabberwock - 11/08/2002 14:12:17 \\ Lord Folken, sounds like you've played WoD games first. In Exalted you DO include the first success in damage dice. Check out the sidebar in Ch. 6: Drama, in the fighting section.
"Prepare to alter fate!"
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Garris - 11/08/2002 16:08:28 - sadness46@hotmail.com \\ ZackSundance, this is not the case. Someone hit for more than one Lethal wound level will lose another lethal wound level every several MINUTES, not rounds. In this example, if Steel Ribbon Warrior gets his act together, he'll be able to stanch the bleeding nicely, Medicine+Wits-1, diff2.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ cluelessnewbie - 11/08/2002 17:27:04 \\ Very good stuff.
Next: Jaida vs. a Dragon-Blooded?
(Or, possibly, Steel vs. a DB--I'm curious as to how an ultra-competent mortal stacks up against a rookie DB.)
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ cluelessnewbie - 11/08/2002 17:35:25 \\ Nitpick: Doesn't a buff jacket have a -1 mobility penalty? Jaida's dodge should've been one lower. (Mind you, she didn't need it in that fight...)
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Juntzing - 11/08/2002 19:06:14 \\ Very cool! THis is just the sort of thing that I need for my new campaign. Introducing non-RP players to the idea through the most story-rich game I feel that I can competently run.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Mailanka - 11/08/2002 19:11:06 \\ <<Nitpick: Doesn't a buff jacket have a -1 mobility penalty? >>
Damn. I even checked the mobility penalty, it just slipped my mind as I was posting. Ahhh well :) Thanks for catching it.
<<Next: Jaida vs. a Dragon-Blooded? >>
Yes.
<<(Or, possibly, Steel vs. a DB--I'm curious as to how an ultra-competent mortal stacks up against a rookie DB.) >>
I could do that if you like. Ikselam would like to discuss "unorthodox" tactics, so I'll also try to do something covering stealth, trickery, running away, stunts, and the stuff that doesn't lend itself well to dissection.
<<This is terrific stuff Mailanka. I am actually enjoying the little story more than the game mechanics! Please continue! >>
That was kind of the idea. :) Glad you're having fun
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ red_archangel - 11/08/2002 19:26:52 \\ Just an idea: can you make Steel become a deathknight? That would do the Vader vs. Obi-Wan pretty well, I think.
Cheers!! Great work here!!
The Red Archangel
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Mailanka - 11/08/2002 21:25:43 \\ Lesson Four: Advanced Charms
You've stumbled through basic combat. You've figured out Extra's, and you know how charms work. However, most discusion you will see around here is NOT how to kill Mooks. It's how to kill another Exalted. Exalted on Exalted action can be the most exciting thing to watch, simply to see how the charms interact. This can also be the most complex topic in these lessons, and so, I will take it slow. Enjoy :)
Blood dripped from Steel Ribbon Warrior's mouth, one eye swollen shot, his arms aching from the restraints. He opened his good eye at the sound of bare feet on stone. Immaculate Toran stepped into view, his long black robes matching his cruel dark eyes. His skin was pale blue with white highlights, like the water of a rushing river.
"She won't come. The last time I saw her, I tried to kill her. You're wasting your time." The words croaked out of Steel's blood crusted lips, but they did not phase Toran.
The Immaculate smiled, and carressed the face of the imprisoned warrior with black jade claws that glistened wetly like the carapace of a scorpion.
"I would not under estimate the love a student holds for her master, heretic. She will come, and I will put her down like the animal she is. For your aid, I will assure you are given a quick death."
Let us examine our enemy. Immaculate Toren is a skilled warrior. He has a Strength of 3, Dexterity of 3, Stamina of 4, and a Wits of 4. He has Martial Arts of 5 with a specialty in Water Dragon Style (+3). He has a Personal Essence pool of 14, a peripheral pool of 31 and 2 motes committed.
He has Jade Razor claws that, with his style, give him the following combat stats: Speed 14 Accuracy 13 Damage 7L and Defense 13.
He has all charms up to Water Dragon Form, and Theft of Essence Method, all from Water Dragon Style, and their effects will be described for those that do not have the book as they come up in play.
He has 1 level of Dragon Blooded Ox-Body Technique.
This makes him a very experience Immaculate, considering most starting Immaculates only have 2 immaculate charms if they have Ox-body.
The sounds of sword clashing against sword announced the presence of Jaida. Slash marks appeared in the door, and then it burst open to admit the woman.
She stepped over the body of a gaurd and the debris of the door, her weapon leveled at the Immaculate. It was Steel's sword...they had sent it to her as proof that they had captured him. Her form was trembling with rage.
"Release him, you bastard. I'm the one you want, not him."
Jaida has grown more experienced since the last time we saw her, to be on par with most starting Solars. She now has Strength 3, Dexterity 3, Stamina 3, Wits of 3, Melee of 5, and the following charms: Ox Body (-1, -2, -2) Exellent Strike, Hungry Tiger Technique, Retrieve the Fallen Weapon, Golden Essence Block, Dipping Swallow Defense, Bulwark Stance, Five-fold Bulwark Stance, Heavenly Gaurdian Defense, and Solar Counter Attack.
With Steel's Ancestoral Sword, She is at Speed 9 Accuracy 10 Damage 6L Defense 10
She is now at Essence 3
All of this can be done at character creation. She is rather typical of an excellent Solar swords(wo)man.
Toren turns, his expression serene as he executes a few quick motions, and then adopts a very fluid, graceful stance. His claws glisten like the rocks in the rapids of a river.
"He suffers because of his involvement with you, Forsaken. His screams have been like hymns to me." His grin is wicked.
faint lines of golden essence glitter around her as she lifts her blade
"You bastard..."
Toren has activated Water Dragon Form. This gives him a Lethal Soak of 9, and adds 3 to his accuracy (making it 16). He has 9 personal Essence remaining.
Jaida has activated Five Fold Bulwark Stance, giving her a reflexive 10 die parry against all attacks that are made against her for the remainder of the scene.
Jaida has 10 personal essene remaining, and 5 willpower left.
Infuriated, Jaida streaks towards Toren, blade shining with essence as it lashes out at him. Toren's motions become even more graceful, slipping away slightly from her attack, but she still strikes home.
He does not lose his serene expression as the essence of her attack splashes against his form, leaving him unharmed.
Instead, he reached for her, and she lept back, sword arm moving insticevly along a tracing of golden essence to parry his attack, by he simply slides through her defenses as though she were not there. Her body rippled faintly as his claws tore away wisps of essence from her soul.
Jaida, angry, decides to go full bore the first turn and pull out excellent strike. She can buy 8 dice for 8 essence, making her attack 18. Toren reflexively activates Flowing Water Defense (it subtracts 1 die from his attack pool, and subtracts 3 from Jaida's) to lower her attack to 15, and then doesn't bother to parry.
Jaida gets 7 successes for 13 damage. In response, Taren activates a special ability of water dragon form, spending 2 motes to add 4 to his soak, making his soak 13. She rolls one die of damage, and gets no successes (you always get at least one die of damage except in very special circumstances)
He responds with Theft-of-Essence. It should be noted at this point that, although he already activated a charm, it was reflexive, and Dragon Blooded may activate reflixes in the same turn they activate another charm.
He must hit her to use this charm, and his attack is currently at 15 (he's at -1 due to (Flowing Water Defense), which averages 7 successes, which will beat Jaida's defenses (10 averages 5 successes). At that point, he doesn't do damage, instead uses the rules for his charm: He rolls strength + MArtial arts: 10 dice(5 successes) vs her Stamina + Resistance: 5 dice (2 successes). He has three successes on her, and so this allows him to steal 9 essence (3x successes) to replenish his stores.
Jaida is at 0 personal Essence, 30 peripheral Toren is at 6 personal Essence, 7 willpower.
I would like to make a note at this point: In general, just whipping out a big attack at the begining is a BAD idea. Inevitably, your opponent will have some kind of defense that will nullify most of your attack. Jaida wasted 8 essence, and Toren only had to burn 3 to nullify it.
Additionally, using an attack charm keeps her from using another charm to defend herself, thus a major attack leaves you vulnerable.
Defense is better than offense. Wait for your opponent to make a mistake, or wear him down.
Jaida lept back from the insidious attack, but Taren pressed the attack towards her, claws lashing out over and over again like waves slamming against a cliff. She dodged and slipped away from the attacks, her sword always in the way, and then flickering out at each momentary opening to strike home.
Her small attacks were begining to have an effect. Blood slipped from a few small cuts.
Her body is gleaming with sunlight, her castemark igniting on her forehead.
Toren has a major speed advantage, and takes iniative. He uses it, splits his dice pool to attack 3 times, giving him 12, 11, 10. The player describes the action well, and so the ST gives him a 1 die stunt bonus on all of his attacks, making it 13, 12, 11 (note, Flowing Water Defense is still active).
This is enough to beat Jaida's defenses, so she opts to abort to a dodge. Again, she is at 4 dodge (5, -1 for Buff Jacket), so she gets 4+10, 3+10, and 2+10. This is barely enough to fend off his attacks.
Additionally, she uses Solar Counter on Each attack, spending 9 essence. This is a reflexive charm, so she may use it before her iniative.
Each counter-attack is at 7 dice(Flowing Water), and he cannot parry or dodge, so she gets 3 successes on each, for 9 damage. 1 die gets through each time, for a grand total of 3 damage. We give her 2 successes (I round up this time, because I round down last time), meaning his wounds have brought him to -1
This begins to show basic Solar superiority. While Toren may activate multiple charms in a turn, Jaida can parry, dodge AND attack at full dice pool THREE times in one round, if she's willing to spend the essence.
It also shows a good way to get past a soak monster. Lots of small attacks will work better than one big one, unless you are VERY strong.
Toren's eyes darkened, and, determined to kill her, he sprang forward, his fervor pushing him forward with impossible speed, like a tsunami trying to crush her. His hand reached for a vital essence-point on her body, one that would kill her with a blow.
There was the sound of a thunder crack and the flare of essence, and Jade clashed with steel. Her anima explodes outward, the billowing sunlight the color of blood, with Jaida at the center, grinning maliciously, held her sword before his attack, foiling his attempt.
Then she stepped forward, her blade slicing a pattern she had learned from her master.
Toren again has iniative, and decides to go all out. He uses Drowning in Blood Technique, a very deadly charm, and channels conviction (5) for a total of 20 (!) dice (Flowing Water Defense is still active. This is the last turn).
Jaida cannot defend against such an attack, so she activates Heavenly Gaurdian Defense, automatically parrying the attack.
Then, having learned from last turn, she splits her dice pool three ways, for 4, 3, and 2 dice. This is barely enough to connect to the unprotected Taren, and will not penetrate soak, but each time, she gets at least one die of damage, for 3 more dice. That's 1 HL this time.
Toren leaps back, taking a defensive posture as Steel Ribbon Warrior chuckles at his back.
Toren snarled, his teeth bared. "I have underestimated you, Forsaken. But I will not make that mistake again..."
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Mailanka - 11/08/2002 21:28:09 \\ Toren snarled, his teeth bared. "I have underestimated you, Forsaken. But I will not make that mistake again..."
Jaida, still grinning, raised her sword defensively, ready for whatever he could throw at her.
This ends the basic lessons. I will likely do a few more, since there are requests. In particular, I am interested in doing one on less stat oriented combat (there is more to battle than just dice pools...)
Hopefully, this has shown those who find the system confusing the basic play of how it works in battle.
I hope you find this useful :)
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Mailanka - 11/08/2002 21:33:29 \\ <<Toren again has iniative, and decides to go all out. He uses Drowning in Blood Technique, a very deadly charm, and channels conviction (5) for a total of 20 (!) dice (Flowing Water Defense is still active. This is the last turn).>>
Whoops. Forgot Wound Penalties. He's actually at 19 (13 accuracy, +3 for Water Dragon form, -1 for flowing Water, - 1 for wounds, +5 for convicion. (13+3+5-1-1=19)) Not that it mattered in this case, but it's nice to know your numbers :)
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ nexus - 11/09/2002 13:55:58 \\ Thanks Mailanka. This has cleared a few things up.
It seems a good place to ask. About incoming attacks, do you think you should generally reveal the nature of it (danger, size of attack pool, etc) to the target so they can opt to use a proper defense or just let them go on the description and guesswork?
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Mailanka - 11/09/2002 15:22:41 \\ Both ideas work. Generally, the player will see your dice pool as you lift that huge number of dice.
But I would generally reveal the danger level to your opponent, otherwise things like HGD are MUCH less useful, since you're guessing all the time.
Either do it with description, or do it with dice pools.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Clebo - 11/09/2002 16:31:32 \\ Hi there!
Mailanka, this is great stuff to read, even for a non-beginner. Would you mind compiling these parts (with corrections) into a submission to the Universe section at the exalted compendium?
On topic, how about a special section on fleeing a combat?
Perhaps can we see a document on the Puff vs Invincible Sword Princess "argument" as well?
In fact, I'd like to see real mock combats between many different Exalts. You do requests? If so, I call for a poll on what we'd like to see the most!
My vote goes to Jaida vs Air Dragon Style Immaculate.
Also, the characters are intriguing, and we have a beginning story here.
Keep it up!
Smiles, Clebo
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Mailanka - 11/09/2002 17:22:45 \\ <<Mailanka, this is great stuff to read, even for a non-beginner. Would you mind compiling these parts (with corrections) into a submission to the Universe section at the exalted compendium?>>
I could do that. Got those artifacts I should post as well...
<<On topic, how about a special section on fleeing a combat?>>
I'm gonna do one on "unorthodox" tactics, things that don't involve straight dice rolling, like using your surroundings, out talking your opponent, fleeing, sneaking, etc.
But I haven't come up with an appropriate "scenario" yet.
<<My vote goes to Jaida vs Air Dragon Style Immaculate.>>
That would be interesting :) Lesee, I've also got a request for Steel (awesome heroic) versus non-immaculate DB. Anything else...?
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Salamander2060 - 11/09/2002 18:29:29 \\ As soon as you have absorbed Lunar, I'd love to see your take on their fighting tactics....
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Mailanka - 11/09/2002 18:35:32 \\ That would be a...while. I won't get the book for another week or two (wooooeeee is me)
And then it will take me a month or so to really get into it. :)
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ jabberwock - 11/09/2002 20:24:49 \\ Alternatively, this wondrous explanation could go into a subsection of the FAQ.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ LynxWinters - 11/11/2002 17:01:38 - lynxwinters@hotmail.com \\ Mailanka: With the whole "using the environment" thing, I can type up a whole lot there, since most of the stuff I do in combat involves more of the scenery than the antagonists.
You're doing an awesome job on all of this, and I printed out your posts for the other players in my group, since they all weren't too clear on how to be effective in a fight. Rock on.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ cluelessnewbie - 11/18/2002 14:21:20 \\ Bump, just to keep this thread around for a while.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ CaliKid - 11/18/2002 14:53:10 \\ Mailanka
Kudos on the Combat training. I liked the story as much as the how to. This will be a must read for all my players.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Nephilpal - 11/18/2002 15:49:16 \\ Thanks. You cleared up all the questions I had about timing.
--Neph
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ cluelessnewbie - 11/19/2002 00:50:58 \\ "I'm gonna do one on "unorthodox" tactics, things that don't involve straight dice rolling, like using your surroundings, out talking your opponent, fleeing, sneaking, etc.
But I haven't come up with an appropriate "scenario" yet."
Either Jaida or a Night Caste being chased though a city by two DBs and about a million mortal guards, maybe?
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Mailanka - 11/19/2002 10:43:08 \\ Wow... I helped Neph?? Awesome!
re: scenario.
It's gotta be able to contain stealth, using terrain (graceful crane stance is such an awesome charm. It's a shame most people don't realize that...), a nifty environment (I'm thinking ice caverns) And a nasty Exalted for her to fight. With the Lunar book, I may use them. They strike me as very much the "use your terrain against your opponent"
They even got charms that do that.
Wow...can't believe this thread is still going...
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ docrabid - 11/20/2002 18:43:16 - docrabid@hotmail.com \\ Heh. I can't believe it's only in its first incarnation. This thread is easily on par with any of the multi-incarnation threads that have been kicking around. Many thanks for the time you've invested!
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ ikselam - 11/20/2002 19:48:52 \\ If it's in ice caverns, the bad guy should be a polar bear Lunar. Or maybe a seal or penguin -- they could end up on iced-over water, and the Lunar could have fun trying to break the ice and send Jaida to her endothermic doom.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ dafyd - 11/20/2002 20:15:32 \\ Could I just ask: if you're a Solar and you see a highly accurate attack that you do not want to be hit by coming towards you - I'm thinking a DB with an extra melee dice charm and a reaver daiklaive - is there anything you can do to avoid it short of a perfect defence charm? Solars, as far as I can see, have no way of getting a better defensive pool than their basic unmodified pool. Lunars, Sidereals, Abyssals, and Terrestrials all can boost their defences. Also I'm playing it that Dipping Swallow Defence allows the Solar to add their Specialities and Weapon Defensive bonus (and requires them to subtract any penalties that apply): i.e. it gives the Solar the pool they would have if they aborted to a parry. Do people agree?
Dafyd
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ NatalieD - 11/20/2002 21:23:06 - gomorrite@catholic.org \\ Solars have Reed in the Wind. Add dice to a dodge. Nice & simple.
I agree with you about Dipping Swallow.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ jpcardier - 11/20/2002 21:26:14 \\ You also can stack defenses, AKA a reflexive Dodge & Parry in a Combo. Or use the scene long versions, which stack...
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Alienated_One - 11/20/2002 22:34:31 \\ <send Jaida to her endothermic doom>
Hypothermic, you mean. Endothermic would entail that she was possibly above a snake pit, or around a sleeper (aka greenland) shark. :(= =)
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Sentinal - 11/20/2002 22:51:42 \\ According to the Errata, you can combine dice buyers with reflexive rolls. Because Golden Essence Block buys you a new action, it can stack with Dipping Swallow, which is a virtual action and not a real one. Takes a little getting your head around, but it makes sense.
Can someone tell me what the offical (not house rule) call on Dipping Swallow is? Does it ignore Specialties AND weapon bonuses? Or since weapon bonuses are added on afterwards, do they still apply?
Sentinel
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Wayeth - 11/21/2002 07:36:49 - wyatt_hebert@hotmail.com \\ Actually, Folken, in Exalted, they don't make the distinction for that 'extra' success that's needed to hit.
You just Take your roll, subtract their defense roll, and add those successes to damage. :) Pg. 231 First Paragraph under Damage. Also, explicitly stated on pg 228, first full paragraph on the right hand column of the 'Order of Combat Events' black box.
Wyatt
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Nephilpal - 11/21/2002 12:09:32 \\
- grin*
Hey, I can't wait to see you break down strategies for Solar vs. Abyssal fights. Come spring...
--Neph
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Daniva - 11/21/2002 12:23:00 \\ "Also I'm playing it that Dipping Swallow Defence allows the Solar to add their Specialities and Weapon Defensive bonus "
I give players specialty and defense dice on any parry, even if it's just a 1 mote Golden Essence Block (which could easily end up at 6 dice). Is that wrong? It seemed like the right way to run the rules, and I don't think people would actually use golden essence block much otherwise (except possibly as part of a combo).
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ dafyd - 11/21/2002 17:27:02 \\ I've just used Errata Downloading Method, as a result of which I've discovered that we're perfectly correct in including all bonuses and penalties with Dipping Swallow Defence. D'oh.
Dafyd
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ jabberwock - 11/21/2002 17:47:52 \\ Yeah, Neph. There's sure to be a "Puff v. ISP v. Fluffy v. Zomboy" thread when it rolls around. And likely a ISP v. Zomboy. I'm surprised that this one is a free-for-all, actually, instead of ISP v. Fluffy.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Alienated_One - 11/21/2002 18:48:16 \\ Mainly because Terrestrials fear war forms, or at least Fallen Angel did when I asked during the last fight. And people have been talking about how potentially obscene someone with a whole helluva lot of Strength in hybrid form (say, the4y were foolish and pumped all of their points into this and Stamina. They're going to be handing out a great deal of whup-ass, say, 32 dice worth with one punch. Add in Limb-Maiming Flourish and Ferocious Biting Sword with a sledge...) is if he has Perfect Earth Body and six gifts to boost things like Soak, which also happen to ignore damage. Adding in my favorite little charm, Cunning Porcupine Defense, would just add insult to injury... or make it impaling. If the Luanr was hugging/constricting you, it would probably be the latter.
Puff should just be glad that the free for all doesn't include Ma-Ha-Suchi or Leviathan. :(= =)
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ BrandonQ - 11/21/2002 19:49:48 - brandonq@bellsouth.net \\ Shame, too, since a free-for-all puts a *lot* more emphasis on the Solar's Persistent Defenses. Though, with the absurd-DB, you've got a pretty decent defense.
I imagine the Lunar would go first, from lack of Defense, unless it managed to just out-power the DB with charms like Lightning Stroke Strike.
Then, the Solar would have to take on whomever was left.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ jabberwock - 11/21/2002 22:42:42 \\ I think the DB and Lunar would be stupid to spend time killing each other before trying to tire out the Solar.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Mailanka - 11/22/2002 03:32:20 \\ <<Hey, I can't wait to see you break down strategies for Solar vs. Abyssal fights. Come spring...>>
The problem with strategy is that there are SO MANY. Persistent defenses are great, sure, but they can be outdiced. Everything has it's vulnerability. The Solar with a soak of 20 naked and loads of strength charms and brawl fights VERY differently from your melee specialist. The guy who whips out Terrifying Apparition of Glory and Snake Form is gonna be psycho, even at like Essence 3 (-6 dice... or -3 dice and 2 successes... your choice)
Though for an Abyssals fight, Edge of Morning Sunlight and Corona of Radiance are a must... only thing is, they are so "Abyssal Specific" that most Solars don't bother to take them. Juinan is the ONLY sig char I've seen with Edge of Morning Sunlight.
Seeing Abyssals will be interesting, though. I suspect, from what the book says, and what really meager crumbs you've dropped (Mainly that you worked hard to make them "dark mirrors" of Solars), that a Solar on Abyssal fight will, mechanically, look pretty similar to a Solar on Solar fight, especially when it comes to persistent defenses, loads of actions, and perfects. Comboes will rule, like usual.
- )
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ majorteroh - 11/22/2002 12:00:33 - majorteroh@aol.com \\ What a fantastic thread, answered a load of questions for me about combat and the story was cool too! btw I agree with you, Mailanka, Graceful Crane Stance is a monkey sick charm.
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ weregerbil - 11/22/2002 14:09:30 - tmarkvar@hotmail.com \\ Can you do something with an example of combos? I've been baffled about combos since Exalted was released. :)
Thanks!
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Mailanka - 11/23/2002 09:09:32 \\ Yeah, sure, I'll see what I can do :)
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Alabrax - 11/23/2002 09:17:57 - rune98@ameritech.net \\ Mailanka I just have to say thank you for this thread. And if its ok with you I would like to copy your examples out of this thread and use them as educational tools on my exalted site. My players and I could really learn from what you have given us here.
Let me know.
-Alabrax www.bengalhead.com/exlated/
\\ Subject: Combat 101\\ Agent333 - 11/23/2002 09:29:08 - toolboy51@hotmail.com \\ Bad-ass thread! I'm ashamed that I didn't read it sooner!
\\ Subject: Combat 101- recap\\ Alabrax - 11/25/2002 13:21:10 - rune98@ameritech.net\\
I just wanted to thank Mailanka for this. Also Mailanka is it ok if I post this on my exalted site for my players to learn from?
These are the unfixed version of your posts BTW.
-Alabrax In Awe.
\\ Subject: Combat 101- recap\\ Mailanka - 11/25/2002 13:24:12\\
Yeah, I want to go back over them, repair some, make sure certain issues are better introduced, and add a scene. I'm just a bit busy at the moment :(
Wow... I'm being qouted. YAY! :)
\\ Subject: Combat 101- recap\\ Alabrax - 11/25/2002 13:26:41 - rune98@ameritech.net\\
I wassnt trying to rush you or anything. More then anything I am reposting this to keep what you posted alive so it doesnt fall off into the abyss.
-Alabrax
\\ Subject: Combat 101- recap\\ Mailanka - 11/25/2002 13:28:34\\
Oh no no. I wasn't offended. Quite the contrary. I was delighted!
I'm just saying I WOULD like to do some more with them. It's supposed to make you happy :)
I'm glad my post has helped so much.
// Subject: Combat 101- recap\\ Zhirem - 11/26/2002 22:02:36\\
Thanks to you both for recapping and the original post.
\\ Subject: Combat 101- recap\\ Sunjumper - 11/26/2002 22:32:00 - jarred@gmx.net\\
Mailanka: This is a work of beauty.
Alabrax: Thank you for reposting.
\\ Subject: Combat 101- recap\\ jpcardier - 11/27/2002 15:53:40\\
A couple of questions, Mailanka:
1.) When holding your action, can you stop hit after the attacker declares? In other words, "high init Solar" holds his action until "low init DB" states: "I'm going hit 3 times and dodge twice". Now can "high init Solar" state "I'm interrupting with an attack! Abort or Die!"? Your example seemed to state otherwise.
2.) You had Jaida Full Dodge and use Solar Counter. Is that allowed? I thought you had to parry.
I'm not a newbie, but these questions had occurred to me....
\\ Subject: Combat 101- recap\\ juntzing - 11/27/2002 23:32:29\\
'Flash'y goodnes is needed...hmm... I've got that itch... ... ... Would you be interested in having this Flash-ed? I have powers of Photoshop and mediocre mouse-sketching powers... Badly animated Exalted! Elite extra Ninjas! Super-deform Steel Ribbon! (Pack of drooling fangirls erupt into screams) 'Course it's been forever and I've not ever actually used Flash before (just Director - same company, slightly different program)
\\ Subject: Combat 101- recap\\ juntzing - 11/27/2002 23:34:39\\
Solar Counterattack allows you to respond to an incoming attack by launching a simultaneous counterattack. You don't have to defend against the incoming hit to use the charm, it's just highly recommended by the surgeon general ;)
\\ Subject: Combat 101- recap\\ Mailanka - 11/28/2002 03:55:02\\
<<1.) When holding your action, can you stop hit after the attacker declares? In other words, "high init Solar" holds his action until "low init DB" states: "I'm going hit 3 times and dodge twice". Now can "high init Solar" state "I'm interrupting with an attack! Abort or Die!"? Your example seemed to state otherwise.>>
Yes. According to the book, if two people must act on the same iniative (the case you describe) the person with the higher iniative total gets to act first. This means you are attacking before he can take his action, forcing him to abort. The book even describes interrupting or pre-empting those of a lower iniative through a held action.
Really what you are doing is seeing the beginings of his motion and then jumping in, forcing him to change his action.
Iniative is a hefty advantage, though not so much for Solars.
