Difference between revisions of "Mortals/AmilikiComments"

Latest revision as of 00:10, 9 June 2010

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It's certainly got potential, The Cult of the Illuminated is one of my favourite factions in the background and it’s always nice to see options for the players who chose to play mortals.
Would be nice to see some more specialist equipment, after all they are trained and equipped by Sidereal Exalted.
One Final note, Gunzosha were around before the Usurpation according to Wonders of the Lost Age. Enchantress

Hey, whoa, a comment! o_o

Sorry I didn't give you any kind of answer sooner Enchantress, I hadn't realized you'd left a message here. But anyway, thanks for the feedback. I've been fiddling with this on and off for a while without anyone seeming to notice, so hearing something - particularly something positive - is reaffirming.

I'd been trying to figure out more specialized equipment for them just recently, though it's oddly easier to think of supernatural things than mundane equipment. I'm more than welcome to suggestions or even additions if you've got any ideas.

Also, I haven't read Wonders of the Lost Age nor really anything else in 2nd Edition beyond parts of the core book. I plan fully on swiping the thaumaturgy system from there, since it's superior to the previous one, but probably won't pay 2nd terribly much mind otherwise. Interesting to hear they changed it, though. >_> - Greymane

Well the new Rulebook allows a mortal Thaumaturge to make the equivalent of a level 1 artefact (with a few restrictions) so it wouldn’t be too unreasonable to allow elite mortal troops to possess them.

Given that the Amiliki have Sidereal patrons I don’t see why they wouldn’t have ready access to lesser artefacts that can still be produced.

Wonders of the Lost Age may really be worth a look, I could picture these guys using Hearthstone Compasses to find lost Manses. Enchantress

My gut reaction, upon reading this, is that the work is both interesting and necessary - Sidereal mortal-ninjas are great. But at the same time, I'm quite unplussed with both the Manse and Artifact backgrounds they have. What possible reason can a mortal have for controlling an Artifact of level 5? Sure, tons of little Artifact 1-2 disposables, minor weapons, et cetera, but level 5 artifacts are, quite simply legendary in strength. In the Age of Sorrows, such things are worth Kingdoms, and not easily manufactured, even by the Sidereals themselves. If nothing else, they're more useful as bargaining tools with other entities or beings than in the hands of a mortal. I can easily see young Solars actively hunting the Amiliki just to get their old sword back. Same general argument with Manses - the stones are such a source of power for those who have pools that actually take time to refill. Useful as boons, tokens, and power sources, hearthstones are rare, and important. (I've half a mind to jokingly point out that the Amiliki obviously need access to hearthstones just to power their large supply of high-level artifacts!) I worry that a primarily mortal being won't even have the essence to commit such high-level artifacts. In some sense, the Amiliki have the same artifact allocation as Solars (in points) - having "Mostly Jade" isn't really much of a restriction. -- GreenLantern

I actually couldn't agree with you more, GL. The Artifacts and Manse backgrounds have been a pain in the butt for me to figure out. On the one hand, I completely agree that there really isn't much reason for mortals to be packing around level 5 artifacts. Not only that, but it goes completely against the "mission statement" of how the Amiliki's adjusted version is described.

On the other hand, a Heroic Mortal character can already technically (i.e. by the rules and not having been forbidden by their ST) get a level 5 Artifact with the normal, unadjusted Artifact. Why they would have it or what on earth they'd do with the thing (beyond hoping it didn't suddenly activate and eat their soul), is beyond me nor, really, my concern. With a good enough story, you can justify damn near anything. Same thing really applies to the Manse background - it's difficult to see a mortal of any caliber managing to hold onto a level 5 Manse with all the gods and demons and Outcastes wandering around, but by the rules there is really very little officially stopping a mortal character from buying one. Yeah, they also need to pay for additional merits to put them to any use, but they can still do it.

This kinda left me in a position of trying to figure out how to make an Artifact and Manse background that was adjusted for the Amilki (who are supposed to have easy access to lots of lesser Artifacts), without ending up apparently worse than the standard issue background. The current versions of the backgrounds up right now are about the fourth or so I've typed up and the second I've actually put up here. I'm not really happy with either, since they went against what I intended for the Amiliki. They were more of a case of just going back, starting from the standard background, and tacking some more points on. As you say though, it doesn't really work so good.

Have a suggestion to help fix it, maybe? Enchantress just helpfully pointed out too that in 2nd edition thaumaturgy (which I intend to swipe when I start putting up thaumaturgical stuff for the Amiliki and mortals in general) mortal thaumaturges can actually craft objects the equivalent of level 1 artifacts, something I somehow missed the first time around. That alone eliminates the need to explain where a lot of their lesser objects would come from – they make them themselves – though that’s not really the issue. Still very useful to know. - Greymane

Why give them Artifact as a background at all? Wouldn't Arsenal be more appropriate? I believe Arsenal also covers hearthstones as well as artifacts. Just a thought.-Ambisinister

To me, one of the things that balanced a mortal's ability to have artifacts and Manses was their relative inability to hold or use them (without spending tons of points elsewhere, at least). I'd think that giving Amiliki weaker versions of the backgrounds, or better yet (as Ambi notes) some variant on Arsenal, or even Leige (toned down, of course). I'd also impose a firm maximum limit of '3' on artifacts or hearthstones they might hold - with resources as scarce as they are in the Cult, and throughout Creation, giving someone an Artifact 4 weapon only ensures that you're going to lose that weapon from your inventory relatively quickly, whether be it by theft, death of the holder, or some other means. Sure, it's technically 'weaker' than the mortal rating, but more sensical - and they make up for it in free merits and other benefits, really. -- GreenLantern

Okay, GL and Abi, on your suggestions I've attempted to whip the Amiliki up their own version of Arsenal. I thought the rulings about it were different enough to go ahead and make it an "official" new background, rather than simply listing it as an edited version of Arsenal, but the principle is more or less the same. I also edited Artifacts and Manse to try a new approach on how to handle those as backgrounds for the Amiliki. I didn't like the idea of putting down text that tried to totally forbid Amiliki from grabbing big stuff (since I both didn't think it should be forbidden and figured anyone who wanted to would just ignore it anyway, on the off chance anyone ever uses the Amiliki), but did want it to be clear that the Amiliki and the Gold Faction don't provide them or even support their agents trying to hold onto that sort of thing. If you get a chance, lemme know if it looks any better. – Greymane

I actually really like it. Given the large number of background options an Amiliki has to spend points on, it's a big investment to go too high in any one of them. Still, the options available give them the depth you'd expect not just from a singular Kung-Fu Ninja, but instead, the wide breadth you'd expect from the Kung-Fu A-team. Everyone can easily have their own focus, and going too deep into Artifact or Manse not only doesn't get you that much, it also means you have less ability to requisition, less contacts, et cetera. I'd stamp this. -- GreenLantern

With your permission Greymane I'd like to use this in my player campaign, possibly even get one of my players building an Amiliki character in a mixed Cricle. Enchantress

Be my guest, Enchantress! In fact, I'd absolutely love to hear how it ends up working out, particularly if you get an Amiliki PC. I don't think I'll get the chance to run an Amiliki game of my own any time soon to actually play test any of it, so I would adore you for life to get any feedback on even an NPC Amiliki in action. – Greymane

Bit of an update, they don't handle mixed games so well (unsuprisingly) they're interesting player characters but for the remainder of the campaign I'm going to be using them as NPCs. Willing to provide a more detailed report about the short lived Amiliki player character. Enchantress

Yeah, it's not all that shocking that they wouldn't handle so well as PCs. Far as my understanding of it has gone, heroic mortals in general don't tend to do so well among Exalts, except in rare cases. But anyway, I'm curious to hear how it went in detail, sure. - Greymane

Tomis and friends (Sorry couldn’t resist the Tomas the tank engine reference) – Enchantress